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Thread: Bring on AJ McCarron !!

  1. #41
    Quote Originally Posted by I_C_DeadPeople View Post
    Except Mikey always 'waits' on these situations lacking the desire or impetus to make a decision.So I suspect we will wait then lose him. We will get a comp pick but that's it

    Exactly. Dried in the wool.

  2. #42
    Quote Originally Posted by I_C_DeadPeople View Post
    Except Mikey always 'waits' on these situations lacking the desire or impetus to make a decision.So I suspect we will wait then lose him. We will get a comp pick but that's it
    So the rumor is that Minny offered a number 1 for him - not sure it was ever confirmed. If it was that was an unusual situation that probably will not present itself again.

    Unless, someone does offer a #1, you need a reliable backup - which is what Mac is. I think keeping him as a backup for insurance and taking a #3 comp pick is just as valuable as a #2.

  3. #43
    Quote Originally Posted by NCStripes View Post
    So the rumor is that Minny offered a number 1 for him - not sure it was ever confirmed. If it was that was an unusual situation that probably will not present itself again.

    Unless, someone does offer a #1, you need a reliable backup - which is what Mac is. I think keeping him as a backup for insurance and taking a #3 comp pick is just as valuable as a #2.
    I would agree with that except given we know (and the team should know) that Dalton has limitations and I would want to know if AJ can be better than Dalton - not saying he would be or would be great/elite, just saying I would want to find out if he would be an upgrade. If No, then you use him as a backup and let some team overpay him and get the comp pick. If Yes, then some decisions should be made.
    Marvin Lewis - the Clapping Clown.

  4. #44
    Quote Originally Posted by I_C_DeadPeople View Post
    .... Dalton has limitations and I would want to know if AJ can be better than Dalton - not saying he would be or would be great/elite, just saying I would want to find out if he would be an upgrade. If No, then you use him as a backup and let some team overpay him and get the comp pick. If Yes, then some decisions should be made.
    There you have it. This is the perfect time and setting to learn more about AJ McCarron. Why waste it?

  5. #45
    Quote Originally Posted by Maldez View Post
    There you have it. This is the perfect time and setting to learn more about AJ McCarron. Why waste it?
    We would say why waste it but ML would say "we cannot take the chance"
    Marvin Lewis - the Clapping Clown.

  6. #46
    Quote Originally Posted by I_C_DeadPeople View Post
    We would say why waste it but ML would say "we cannot take the chance"
    Here's the way I put it. When a MLB team knows it can't make the playoffs, they often bring up young pitchers and put them in the rotation to see what they have in them. Why should the NFL be any different?

  7. #47
    Quote Originally Posted by Lewdog View Post
    Here's the way I put it. When a MLB team knows it can't make the playoffs, they often bring up young pitchers and put them in the rotation to see what they have in them. Why should the NFL be any different?
    Because baseball has ten times as many games to play around with. Mike Brown is still about selling seats. Back up QBs don't sell tickets.
    Only users lose drugs

  8. #48
    Quote Originally Posted by Pre_hungover View Post
    Because baseball has ten times as many games to play around with. Mike Brown is still about selling seats. Back up QBs don't sell tickets.
    I have to disagree there. The right back-up QB can actually bring back the fans that the starting QB lost. Remember Jeff Blake and the "Shake-N-Blake" hype he created? Bengal fans have seen the good, the bad, and the ugly that Andy Dalton brings, and I for one would love to see A.J. McCarron finish out the season.

  9. #49
    Jeff Blake only played because both Klingler and the backup were hurt in the same game (I was at that one in Cleveland). Coslet was forced to play him the following week against Dallas (was at that one too) because both QB's were still hurt. He had a great game...but Coslet still said Klingler was the starter. When he couldn't go the next week, Blake played well again, and the decision was made. There was no changeout from a healthy starter to the backup, as you infer.
    "This game isn't worth it. The National Football League isn't worth it. There's golf to be played and tennis to be served up and other things to be done out there besides worryin' about a friggin' football game."----The prophet Sam Wyche

  10. #50
    Quote Originally Posted by Maldez View Post
    I have to disagree there. The right back-up QB can actually bring back the fans that the starting QB lost. Remember Jeff Blake and the "Shake-N-Blake" hype he created? Bengal fans have seen the good, the bad, and the ugly that Andy Dalton brings, and I for one would love to see A.J. McCarron finish out the season.
    Andy Dalton isn't the reason they are losing. Anybody that's not going to games because of Andy Dalton is an idiot and there is no need to cater to idiots. Comparing 2016 to the 90s is a bit dramatic, don'tcha think? Klingler and Blake aren't anywhere near Dalton as a QB.

    What exactly would the Bengals gain by starting McCarron? A higher draft pick from his future team? So a currently unknown opponent gains more from Cincy giving McCarron playing time than the Bengals gain. McCarron gets to sharpen his skills for a future employer while the rest of the offense gets put on hold for a month before starting over where they left off.

    Boyd and Dalton are starting to get on the same page . . . let's stop that for a month(8 months).

    Ogbuehi sucked for most of the season but looked good until the final drive against the Bills and the fourth quarter against Terrell Suggs. He's playing better now but let's put someone else in at QB so he can adjust to him before he disappears and has to go back to learning from Dalton again.

    Cody Core is just now seeing the field, he needs to play with AD at QB for the same reason as Boyd.

    The Bengals long term plans don't appear to meet your short term needs.
    Only users lose drugs

  11. #51
    Quote Originally Posted by Le Tigre View Post
    Jeff Blake only played because both Klingler and the backup were hurt in the same game (I was at that one in Cleveland). Coslet was forced to play him the following week against Dallas (was at that one too) because both QB's were still hurt. He had a great game...but Coslet still said Klingler was the starter. When he couldn't go the next week, Blake played well again, and the decision was made. There was no changeout from a healthy starter to the backup, as you infer.
    I inferred that there was "a changeout from a healthy starter to the backup"? I don't believe so...just said Blake created quite a fan buzz with his ""Shake-N-Blake" style of play. McCarron could possibly do the same. Why not take a look?

  12. #52
    Quote Originally Posted by Pre_hungover View Post
    ....What exactly would the Bengals gain by starting McCarron? ....
    They would quite possibly gain a much-needed spark, an energy, a kick in the ass...they seem to be going through the motions. Let's do SOMETHING to shake things up!

  13. #53
    Quote Originally Posted by Maldez View Post
    I inferred that there was "a changeout from a healthy starter to the backup"? I don't believe so...just said Blake created quite a fan buzz with his ""Shake-N-Blake" style of play. McCarron could possibly do the same. Why not take a look?
    We all had a "look" at him for the final 6 games a year ago. Wasn't bad, wasn't great. He did what he could do. Overall, I liked what I saw. The closest thing to a "fan buzz" generated, was the brief aftermath of the Green TD at the end of the Playoff Game. But, there would have been that "buzz" if you or I had thrown it.

    And, even though I loathe saying any QB has a won-loss record like baseball pitchers, AJ went 3-3 in his 6 games. FWIW.
    "This game isn't worth it. The National Football League isn't worth it. There's golf to be played and tennis to be served up and other things to be done out there besides worryin' about a friggin' football game."----The prophet Sam Wyche

  14. #54
    Quote Originally Posted by Le Tigre View Post
    We all had a "look" at him for the final 6 games a year ago. Wasn't bad, wasn't great. He did what he could do. Overall, I liked what I saw. The closest thing to a "fan buzz" generated, was the brief aftermath of the Green TD at the end of the Playoff Game. But, there would have been that "buzz" if you or I had thrown it.

    And, even though I loathe saying any QB has a won-loss record like baseball pitchers, AJ went 3-3 in his 6 games. FWIW.
    6 games isn't much of a look, which is exactly why I'd like to see more. The guy QB'd consecutive national championship teams, he's got to have a winning pedigree. The Bengals are 3-7-1, let's take AJ out for a test drive.

  15. #55
    Quote Originally Posted by Maldez View Post
    6 games isn't much of a look, which is exactly why I'd like to see more. The guy QB'd consecutive national championship teams, he's got to have a winning pedigree. The Bengals are 3-7-1, let's take AJ out for a test drive.

    There is no QB controversy in Cincy, and no reason to create one. Although I've never been a big Dalton fan, he's not the main problem with the team. You don't just bench the leader and face of your team, in the NFL, just to see if you might like the backup better. It's just not done that way, and it won't be done in Cincy.

    Moot debate. Never will happen.

  16. #56
    Administrator Super Cat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Maldez View Post
    6 games isn't much of a look, which is exactly why I'd like to see more. The guy QB'd consecutive national championship teams, he's got to have a winning pedigree. The Bengals are 3-7-1, let's take AJ out for a test drive.
    The college game means very little to the NFL game. I said when Trent Richardson came out from Alabama that he wasn't as good as everyone said he was. Even though he was clearly the top running back in college ball that year and the Tide winning a National championship. He only looked as good as he did because of his offensive line. The same goes with McCarron. He had an amazing offensive line that lead the team to two championships.
    last year the Bengals line was much better than this year. You shouldn't get your backup hurt just because you want to see what he can do in meaningless games. Dalton has the experience of working with a bad offensive line throughout his career. McCarron has never played behind a line that was bad.

  17. #57
    Quote Originally Posted by Super Cat View Post
    The college game means very little to the NFL game. I said when Trent Richardson came out from Alabama that he wasn't as good as everyone said he was. Even though he was clearly the top running back in college ball that year and the Tide winning a National championship. He only looked as good as he did because of his offensive line. The same goes with McCarron. He had an amazing offensive line that lead the team to two championships.
    last year the Bengals line was much better than this year. You shouldn't get your backup hurt just because you want to see what he can do in meaningless games. Dalton has the experience of working with a bad offensive line throughout his career. McCarron has never played behind a line that was bad.
    McCarron is more mobile than Dalton in my opinion.

  18. #58
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lewdog View Post
    McCarron is more mobile than Dalton in my opinion.
    Mobile only means he runs from pressure. He doesn't mean he is better against it.

  19. #59
    Quote Originally Posted by Super Cat View Post
    Mobile only means he runs from pressure. He doesn't mean he is better against it.
    How do we know what he can do if he doesn't get to play against it in game situations?

  20. #60
    Quote Originally Posted by Super Cat View Post
    Mobile only means he runs from pressure. He doesn't mean he is better against it.
    Exactly.
    Quote Originally Posted by Lewdog View Post
    How do we know what he can do if he doesn't get to play against it in game situations?
    First off, it's not important for you or any other fan to know how AJ McCarron plays in game situations. The more you know, the more opponents know. The only QB controversy in Cincinnati comes from fans that don't know a lot about QB play. Seriously, you guys are getting into Tiger J@w territory. There are no grumblings from players, there's no talking heads talking about it at all. Just people on the internet that don't like Andy Dalton probably because they've never played QB in an organized setting and don't know how much Dalton actually does for this team. Watch the Cardinals play and watch Carson hustle to the line to get the snap off with one second or zeros on the play clock about ten-fifteen times a game and maybe you'll reflect on what it's like with a QB that doesn't have it between the ears.

    You want to watch McCarron play? He needs to beat out the starter and then we'll find out. That's how sports work. No participation trophies allowed at this level.
    Only users lose drugs

  21. #61
    MFB wants $$$ not wins! TigerJ@w's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pre_hungover View Post
    Exactly.

    First off, it's not important for you or any other fan to know how AJ McCarron plays in game situations. The more you know, the more opponents know. The only QB controversy in Cincinnati comes from fans that don't know a lot about QB play. Seriously, you guys are getting into Tiger J@w territory. There are no grumblings from players, there's no talking heads talking about it at all. Just people on the internet that don't like Andy Dalton probably because they've never played QB in an organized setting and don't know how much Dalton actually does for this team. Watch the Cardinals play and watch Carson hustle to the line to get the snap off with one second or zeros on the play clock about ten-fifteen times a game and maybe you'll reflect on what it's like with a QB that doesn't have it between the ears.

    You want to watch McCarron play? He needs to beat out the starter and then we'll find out. That's how sports work. No participation trophies allowed at this level.
    Your King has won how many playoff games in the NFL? What have you played? I do not recall your name being mentioned in the NFL, snowflake!
    "We started with a very low standard, so we have nowhere to go but up," offensive coordinator Jay Gruden said. So you set your standards as low? WOW!

    "Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it."

    Who controls the past controls the future: who controls the present controls the past.

  22. #62
    MFB wants $$$ not wins! TigerJ@w's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LimaBengal View Post
    There is no QB controversy in Cincy, and no reason to create one. Although I've never been a big Dalton fan, he's not the main problem with the team. You don't just bench the leader and face of your team, in the NFL, just to see if you might like the backup better. It's just not done that way, and it won't be done in Cincy.

    Moot debate. Never will happen.
    I guess you think the same way about Mediocre Marv? Of course you do not, so what is the difference? If you have not noticed QBs are pulled all the time when teams are losing, but what do I know. What is that ole sayin about the definition of insanity? Oh yea, doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result. Insane! I guess you think Nugent should stay in too since there is no kicker controversy? This post coming from you, I am shocked.
    "We started with a very low standard, so we have nowhere to go but up," offensive coordinator Jay Gruden said. So you set your standards as low? WOW!

    "Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it."

    Who controls the past controls the future: who controls the present controls the past.

  23. #63
    Administrator Super Cat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TigerJ@w View Post
    I guess you think the same way about Mediocre Marv? Of course you do not, so what is the difference? If you have not noticed QBs are pulled all the time when teams are losing, but what do I know. What is that ole sayin about the definition of insanity? Oh yea, doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result. Insane! I guess you think Nugent should stay in too since there is no kicker controversy? This post coming from you, I am shocked.
    If the problem was Dalton, then switch QB's. But Dalton isn't the problem. Stay with the proven.

  24. #64
    I have seen from some, the comment that with good protection, a good QB can make not-so-great receivers look great.

    Saw that yesterday. AJ Mac probably could have done that too, but wasn't needed. Neither was that "shake-up" thing.
    "This game isn't worth it. The National Football League isn't worth it. There's golf to be played and tennis to be served up and other things to be done out there besides worryin' about a friggin' football game."----The prophet Sam Wyche

  25. #65
    Quote Originally Posted by Le Tigre View Post
    I have seen from some, the comment that with good protection, a good QB can make not-so-great receivers look great.

    Saw that yesterday. AJ Mac probably could have done that too, but wasn't needed. Neither was that "shake-up" thing.
    Andy Boy played pretty good yesterday, the whole team seemingly came out of its funk together, and I'll surely take it. But what's funny is if AJ McCarron had gotten the start he'd likely have been given the credit for shaking things up and I'd have looked smart, which is obviously not the case.

  26. #66
    You are smart, good sir.
    "This game isn't worth it. The National Football League isn't worth it. There's golf to be played and tennis to be served up and other things to be done out there besides worryin' about a friggin' football game."----The prophet Sam Wyche

  27. #67
    Quote Originally Posted by TigerJ@w View Post
    I guess you think the same way about Mediocre Marv? Of course you do not, so what is the difference? If you have not noticed QBs are pulled all the time when teams are losing, but what do I know. What is that ole sayin about the definition of insanity? Oh yea, doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result. Insane! I guess you think Nugent should stay in too since there is no kicker controversy? This post coming from you, I am shocked.

    You're shocked because I don't think Dalton should be benched ??

    LOL

  28. #68
    Play mccarron for the simple entertainment value.
    Dona eis Requiem

  29. #69
    Administrator Super Cat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SladeX View Post
    Play mccarron for the simple entertainment value.
    What entertainment?

  30. #70
    Quote Originally Posted by SladeX View Post
    Play mccarron for the simple entertainment value.

    How about "messenger QBs ?

    Like PB's messenger guards. lol

  31. #71
    Quote Originally Posted by Super Cat View Post
    What entertainment?
    Consternated experts. Mainly. I love it when talking heads fisplay their cluelessness.
    Sering what the kids got. Or not got.

    Actually Dalton doesn't deserve to be benched.
    Dona eis Requiem

  32. #72
    Quote Originally Posted by LimaBengal View Post
    How about "messenger QBs ?

    Like PB's messenger guards. lol
    (Claps hands loudly) I like it!!!
    Dona eis Requiem

  33. #73
    http://mmqb.si.com/mmqb/2016/12/07/n...ie-john-dorsey

    Good article on Ron Wolf, especially the part about drafting QB's (pretty much why I advocated picking up a guy like Carr)

    Wolf’s most notable stamp on modern scouting is his view on quarterbacks: While there’s only room for one starter, you can never acquire too many. In Wolf’s world, it is worthwhile to draft a QB every year, no matter the current roster situation. “Looking now from afar, the best quarterback in the game is a sixth-round draft choice [Tom Brady], and that should alert everybody,” Wolf says. “Then you look at what the Cowboys have accomplished with a fourth-round draft choice. I mean, it tells you what you should do. Those who do not know history are doomed to repeat it.”

    Consider that in seven out of eight drafts from 1992 to ’99, Wolf drafted a quarterback, even after Brett Favre was entrenched as the starter. “I learned very early in this game, if you don’t have a quarterback, you don’t have a chance,” Wolf said. “We were very lucky that we had a unique quarterback that never missed a game. But that didn’t stop me from drafting in late rounds. It’s the premiere position, and you better be able to cover yourself.”

    In acquiring extra arms—among them Ty Detmer (1992 ninth round), Mark Brunell (’93 fifth round), Matt Hasselbeck (’98 sixth round) and Aaron Brooks (’99 fourth round), all of whom became starters for other teams—Wolf says he was bringing in players to challenge Favre. But more importantly, he was looking for raw talent to cultivate for backup roles, or to dangle for a trade and acquire even more draft picks.

    “As long as you have the good coaches willing to take the time to develop, that model can work,” says Dorsey, who has taken QBs in two of his four drafts with the Chiefs.

    “You’re not picking a quarterback every year just to stockpile them,” says McKenzie, who drafted Connor Cook in last year’s fourth round even with budding 25-year-old star Derek Carr and 26-year-old backup Matt McGloin already under contract. “But I have to say Ron Wolf's philosophy was most ingrained in me, in the process of picking Conor Cook. Even though we have a starter, and a backup for another year or two, that’s beside the point. If you have a guy ranked high in the draft, and he somehow falls to you, you don’t say, ‘Well, I need a receiver, so I'm going to take a guy that's much lesser ranked [on our draft board] than a quarterback.’ You take the quarterback, especially in the late round, over a need position and hope he gives you some value.

    “That’s how important the position is. Ron always taught us to not see what’s right in front of you, but look down the road. That’s what we did with Aaron Brooks and Matt Hasselbeck, and what I did with Connor Cook.”

    In evaluating the 2017 draft class, this strategy could be prominent. There are no surefire franchise quarterbacks, or even surefire first-round picks, as teams could be reaching for Deshaun Watson or Mitch Trubisky, DeShone Kizer or Brad Kaaya should any of the underclassmen declare early. However, there is a plethora of intriguing talent deeper in the pool, including Davis Webb of California, Pat Mahomes of Texas Tech, Nate Peterman of Pittsburgh, Taysom Hill of BYU, Mason Rudolph of Oklahoma State and Seth Russell of Baylor.

    Which, naturally, brings up this question: How does a team determine who is worth taking a flier on?

    “It’s blind luck,” Wolf said. “If I knew how to put together a quarterback, I’d have my own island somewhere.
    Marvin Lewis - the Clapping Clown.

  34. #74
    "It's blind luck."

    Why yes, it is.
    "This game isn't worth it. The National Football League isn't worth it. There's golf to be played and tennis to be served up and other things to be done out there besides worryin' about a friggin' football game."----The prophet Sam Wyche

  35. #75
    Quote Originally Posted by Le Tigre View Post
    "It's blind luck."

    Why yes, it is.
    I like rhe philosophy. AJ for instance has been far from a wasted pick. We should be doing this , drafting a qb most years
    Dona eis Requiem

  36. #76
    Quote Originally Posted by SladeX View Post
    Consternated experts. Mainly. I love it when talking heads fisplay their cluelessness.
    Sering what the kids got. Or not got.

    Actually Dalton doesn't deserve to be benched.
    Red wine, or white?

  37. #77
    Quote Originally Posted by SladeX View Post
    Consternated experts. Mainly. I love it when talking heads fisplay their cluelessness.
    Sering what the kids got. Or not got.

    Actually Dalton doesn't deserve to be benched.
    Red wine, or white?

  38. #78
    Quote Originally Posted by Maldez View Post
    Red wine, or white?
    I don't drink, lol...

    As much as id like to see AJ play, from what little ive seen this season. Dalton is a strength of the team. Coaching is the problem. Dalton has rounded into a good qb. He ain't btady 2.0, but he sura as hell aint kitna or O'Donnell or...
    Dona eis Requiem

  39. #79
    Quote Originally Posted by SladeX View Post
    I don't drink, lol...

    As much as id like to see AJ play, from what little ive seen this season. Dalton is a strength of the team. Coaching is the problem. Dalton has rounded into a good qb. He ain't btady 2.0, but he sura as hell aint kitna or O'Donnell or...
    What about Gus Frerotte?

  40. #80
    Quote Originally Posted by Lewdog View Post
    What about Gus Frerotte?
    Lefty, lol.

    Scott Mitchell.
    Dona eis Requiem

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