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Thread: The position pick with 9th pick

  1. #1
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    The position pick with 9th pick

    Unlike many of you, I'm not able to watch college games. So I can't pin down one player for pick 9. But I believe we will go DE with first pick. So far I've looked at a few mock drafts and there are 4 players that the mocks are picking here.
    Some are saying draft needs are RB, WR, LB and DE. To me we could add OL. But looking at the roster I believe it is LB'er. But I don't think Mike pulls trigger on LB. It has been a need for many years. Most here are going toward running back. But I think RB needs a powerful OL to succeed early and Hill could do the job with a powerful OL. With WR we just need one with speed opposite of Green. That player can be had in later rounds after round one.
    So I'm going DE because that is the unit with the most age on them. Three guys with 8 years or more starting. Time to rebuild that unit while it is still strong. Dunlap and Atkins are signed for a few years. No problem there. But the other side needs power and speed quickly.

    So tell me which position do you think will be our first pick?

  2. #2
    Sith Lord ralphmtsu's Avatar
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    I'm thinking DE in the first-- Barnett from TN? I don't see WR as a need early in the draft. Green is of course Green. LaFell played well last year and is a pro's pro. Could do a lot worse for a #2. Boyd was one of the better rookies and improved as the season went along. We also have Erickson who showed flashes. If we were drafting lower in the first round, I'd consider Cam Robinson for the OL, but 9 is way too high. At LB, they picked up Minter from the Cardinals, so LB is not really an early need and we always devalue the LB. Also, I don't see RB as a need per se. With Hill and Gio, we have 2 serviceable RBs, but the loss of Burkhead makes me think RB will be addressed early. I bet we take Mixon in the 2nd round. As I see it, our needs are OL, Pass Rush and RB. It would be intersting to see if we try to move up using our comp picks. I'd like to get 2 picks in the 2nd round.
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  3. #3
    spicoli's Avatar
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    two things here....

    a) while we do have need for OL, it's simply not a match in the first round, the talent just isn't there this year.
    b) you can really same the same thing about the DL, the talent doesn't really match the draft position UNLESS someone like Solomon Thomas or Jon Allen were to fall out of the top 8......this draft is loaded with DL and Edge talent, guys like Derek Barnett and Taco Charlton have been mocked anywhere from 10 all the way into the 2nd round and one of the reasons for that is because you can get very similar talent at those positions a little later on in this particular draft.

    IMO, they want game-changing speed at 9 because the pickings will be pretty slim for those guys after the first round.....if I were a betting man I'd say it will be either Christian McCaffrey or John Ross. (probably Ross though because Carolina is supposedly in love with McCaffrey and they pick one spot in front of us)

    I know this...IF for some reason Fournette should fall out of the top 8 (which isn't likely) you can take that pick to the bank, the Bengals will be sprinting up to the podium with his name on the card......I actually wouldn't be all that surprised if they traded up a few spots to get him to tell ya the truth, they supposedly like him that much.
    “We are not going in circles, we are going upwards. The path is a spiral; we have already climbed many steps.” --Hermann Hesse, Siddhartha

  4. #4
    To me, Barnett would be the 'safe' play and we often do our best drafting with the safer bets (less success with projects such as Hunt). Fournette would also be a pretty safe bet. Kiper's now has us picking Reddick, that would be a higher risk/higher reward type pick. Although we do not need more picks I would not mind a trade down and then later a trade up or two. I know, I know, too much action for old sleepy Mike but this would be the draft to aggressively target several players that can have an early impact.
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  5. #5
    spicoli's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by I_C_DeadPeople View Post
    To me, Barnett would be the 'safe' play
    do you really know enough about Barnett to say that though?

    there's a few sites here and there that have him getting into the top 10 but if you follow the guys that are either actually scouts or have ins with actual scouts, those guys have him in the late 20's early 30's.

    Barnett to me is very heavy handed and seems to make a lot of hay by bullying OT's at the college level, I don't see how that's gonna work at the pro level....also, as an athlete, he's very very average....IMO you can get that same guy in rounds 2-3.
    “We are not going in circles, we are going upwards. The path is a spiral; we have already climbed many steps.” --Hermann Hesse, Siddhartha

  6. #6
    I am a little concerned about Eifert's back. I know he said he was fine, but for how long? Maybe that weighs into the equation and I could see us taking Howard. I am still high on us taking a LBer also, I like Foster at #9.
    Big fan of Ross and Reddick but is #9 to high?? I wouldn't be upset if we took either, Ross is a flippin playmaker. Foster just seems like the immediate impact we need.

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by spicoli View Post
    do you really know enough about Barnett to say that though?

    there's a few sites here and there that have him getting into the top 10 but if you follow the guys that are either actually scouts or have ins with actual scouts, those guys have him in the late 20's early 30's.

    Barnett to me is very heavy handed and seems to make a lot of hay by bullying OT's at the college level, I don't see how that's gonna work at the pro level....also, as an athlete, he's very very average....IMO you can get that same guy in rounds 2-3.
    I agree with that. So welcome to the Bengals Mr. Barnett!!! LOL

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by spicoli View Post
    do you really know enough about Barnett to say that though?

    there's a few sites here and there that have him getting into the top 10 but if you follow the guys that are either actually scouts or have ins with actual scouts, those guys have him in the late 20's early 30's.

    Barnett to me is very heavy handed and seems to make a lot of hay by bullying OT's at the college level, I don't see how that's gonna work at the pro level....also, as an athlete, he's very very average....IMO you can get that same guy in rounds 2-3.
    We all know that following draft sites is a bit of a muggs game (although we have no choice since little or know info is known about each teams draft boards). Having said that, many boards have him listed as top 10 given his college production and some top 15. Will it translate? Always the guessing part of it but some sights have Fournette as over rated as well. But I would classify him as a safer bet merely because of his excellent college production and the fact that he is not learning a new position. PFF has him as one of the 10 'safe' picks.

    https://www.profootballfocus.com/dra...draft-options/

    I seem to recall a lot of boards saying JJ Watt's college game would translate into an average player in the NFL. Sometimes, I think production is over looked a bit? Anyway, I was trying to think like Bengals would. My guess is they may go the safe route and maybe use some late picks on real flyers.


    The pick will be ...
    Rob Rang: Derek Barnett, DE, Tennessee. Adding a young pass rusher to complement veterans Geno Atkins and Carlos Dunlap is expected to be among the Bengals' top draft-day priorities. Barnett lacks the ideal traits that club president Mike Brown has prioritized in the past, but his production (NCAA-best 33 sacks over past three seasons) against elite competition speaks for itself and he possesses the pro-ready game and work ethic to continue this success in the NFL.
    Dane Brugler: Derek Barnett, DE, Tennessee. While not in the same stratosphere as Myles Garrett from a physical or athletic standpoint, Barnett has a more impressive resume and that counts for something. He isn't a twitchy edge rusher, but his get-off, bend and awareness allow him to make an impact vs. the pass and the run.
    Marvin Lewis - the Clapping Clown.

  9. #9
    spicoli's Avatar
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    I'd take Tak McKinley or Charles Harris all day long over Barnett or Taco Charlton.

    I'd take Riddick over them as well.

    IMO it's going to be an impact player on offense....McCaffrey or Ross would be my bet, guys that can break a game open from multiple spots anytime they touch the football.
    Last edited by spicoli; 04-20-2017 at 06:46 PM.
    “We are not going in circles, we are going upwards. The path is a spiral; we have already climbed many steps.” --Hermann Hesse, Siddhartha

  10. #10
    Most definitely NOT going to be Faster at this point. First he might need shoulder surgery again, secondly he got sent home from the combine, and now it has come out he failed his drug test at the combine for having a diluted sample. He'll start his career in the substance abuse program. Fu cking dope heads can't control themselves enough to cost themselves MILLIONS of dollars.

  11. #11
    spicoli's Avatar
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    I'd take him in the 2nd.....he'd definitely come in good and pissed off if that happened.
    “We are not going in circles, we are going upwards. The path is a spiral; we have already climbed many steps.” --Hermann Hesse, Siddhartha

  12. #12
    On the Barnett question: Spicoli and Sandwedge are right. When you see him projected in the top ten, it's from mockers who are basing things on headlines. But if you watch him and really know who the process works, he just won't go that high. He'll be an OK player, but not worth the 9th pick. For the reasons Spicoli mentions.

    And as far as who we'll take, it really has to do with value and how the board falls more so than need. If Allen is there I think we'll take him, but wouldn't be shocked if we passed. Assuming he and Thomas are gone, it just makes more sense to focus elsewhere. The value isn't there at LB or OL. But it will be at WR. Those of you pointing out that we're ok at WR miss the point... we have a chance to take a real difference maker (which Barnett probably will not be) at 9. I really think it might be John Ross. LaFell would start while Ross heals and acclimates to the NFL. And think of it in a year or two... Ross, Green and Boyd as a trio of WRs. That's ridiculous. A good-but-not-great DE doesn't really compare.

    Want a surprise pick? Gareon Conley. Think about it. Right now I think it's either going to be Allen, Ross or Conley.

  13. #13
    One of the best things I've heard lately is that Buffalo worked out Deshaun Watson and supposedly really likes him. Which means if you really want Watson you got to get ahead of Buffalo. Cue the Bengals.

  14. #14
    spicoli's Avatar
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    My surprise pick is Charles Harris....kid is a flat out baller.
    “We are not going in circles, we are going upwards. The path is a spiral; we have already climbed many steps.” --Hermann Hesse, Siddhartha

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Bengali View Post
    And think of it in a year or two... Ross, Green and Boyd as a trio of WRs. That's ridiculous.

    .
    how many more quality vets will be gone in a year or 2 ? we have to quit picking 1st round players that have to be redshirted due to injury/being a project. evry now and then i can understand but if theydo this will be the 3rd year in a row their 1st rounder wouldnt be playing.

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stryker57 View Post
    how many more quality vets will be gone in a year or 2 ? we have to quit picking 1st round players that have to be redshirted due to injury/being a project. evry now and then i can understand but if theydo this will be the 3rd year in a row their 1st rounder wouldnt be playing.
    why would he be redshirted though?
    “We are not going in circles, we are going upwards. The path is a spiral; we have already climbed many steps.” --Hermann Hesse, Siddhartha

  17. #17
    All things considered, whoever is taken is one heckuva good football player. It is always fun watching these guys grow into the next-level game.
    "This game isn't worth it. The National Football League isn't worth it. There's golf to be played and tennis to be served up and other things to be done out there besides worryin' about a friggin' football game."----The prophet Sam Wyche

  18. #18
    The value would be safety, but it's not a need and Bengals don't value the position. Barnett is the "safe" pick, but doesn't make the team any faster. Foster seems to be having a bad couple of months and I don't see that getting better after the draft. I'm not a Dalvin Cook fan for various reasons including the value of the position. Another CB is the most unsexy pick and would have value, but seriously.. This gets me rooting for Reddick, who I know can rush the passer and would increase the defensive speed at LB or DE. As a dark horse I like Corey Davis, who is a better receiver than Williams, but doesn't have that incredible catch radius. Or a 3-4 DE could drop and we end up with a good power end, but not a speed rusher, which is a need.

  19. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by spicoli View Post
    why would he be redshirted though?
    sorry should have left in from Bengali's post " LaFell would start while Ross heals and acclimates to the NFL"

  20. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by sandwedge View Post
    I am a little concerned about Eifert's back. I know he said he was fine, but for how long? Maybe that weighs into the equation and I could see us taking Howard. I am still high on us taking a LBer also, I like Foster at #9.
    Big fan of Ross and Reddick but is #9 to high?? I wouldn't be upset if we took either, Ross is a flippin playmaker. Foster just seems like the immediate impact we need.
    I agree with the concern about Eifert. I think we take Howard if he is there.

  21. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by Stryker57 View Post
    sorry should have left in from Bengali's post " LaFell would start while Ross heals and acclimates to the NFL"
    I wouldn't use the word redshirted necessarily, but to answer Spicoli's question I meant because he's recovering from labrum surgery and would probably start on the PUP. And Wrs don't acclimate quickly in general. So his ceilling as a rookie to me is very good kick returner, and 4th WR and situational lid-lifter. That's still value to be sure, but it's year two that we'd have a lethal Green/Ross/Boyd combo.

  22. #22
    I wasn't really a Ross fan until I watched his tape, mostly because I prefer bigger WRs. Dalton has gotten better at the deep ball but it's still not his strong suit, so sub 6-foot deep threat specialists never made sense to me. But watch the tape and I see a taller, faster Antonio Brown. I mean his hip swivel and twitch are incredible.

  23. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by puddycat View Post
    The value would be safety, but it's not a need and Bengals don't value the position. Barnett is the "safe" pick, but doesn't make the team any faster. Foster seems to be having a bad couple of months and I don't see that getting better after the draft. I'm not a Dalvin Cook fan for various reasons including the value of the position. Another CB is the most unsexy pick and would have value, but seriously.. This gets me rooting for Reddick, who I know can rush the passer and would increase the defensive speed at LB or DE. As a dark horse I like Corey Davis, who is a better receiver than Williams, but doesn't have that incredible catch radius. Or a 3-4 DE could drop and we end up with a good power end, but not a speed rusher, which is a need.
    Was just reading an article on Reddick. Seems he played more "off-ball" LB in Temple's defense than DE. This leads me to not see him as that dreaded "tweener" as much as a really fast, downhill, LB. Is that worth the top pick? Couldn't hurt I suppose.

    Spic has said for months now that game-changing skills should be the BPA for this pick. Speed is something you can't coach, so maybe Ross is just the ticket?
    "This game isn't worth it. The National Football League isn't worth it. There's golf to be played and tennis to be served up and other things to be done out there besides worryin' about a friggin' football game."----The prophet Sam Wyche

  24. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by Lewdog View Post
    Most definitely NOT going to be Faster at this point. First he might need shoulder surgery again, secondly he got sent home from the combine, and now it has come out he failed his drug test at the combine for having a diluted sample. He'll start his career in the substance abuse program. Fu cking dope heads can't control themselves enough to cost themselves MILLIONS of dollars.
    Wouldn't you know it, I post I like Foster at #9 and 20 minutes later I read he failed a drug test......I wonder what drug it was?

  25. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by Bengali View Post
    I wasn't really a Ross fan until I watched his tape, mostly because I prefer bigger WRs. Dalton has gotten better at the deep ball but it's still not his strong suit, so sub 6-foot deep threat specialists never made sense to me. But watch the tape and I see a taller, faster Antonio Brown. I mean his hip swivel and twitch are incredible.
    Living in Washington, I got to see Ross a lot. The guy is fast, but he is quicker than anyone I have seen with very good hands.

  26. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by Bengali View Post
    One of the best things I've heard lately is that Buffalo worked out Deshaun Watson and supposedly really likes him. Which means if you really want Watson you got to get ahead of Buffalo. Cue the Bengals.
    And the Browns have been tied to chatter about moving their second first round pick up higher to get a QB
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  27. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by sandwedge View Post
    Wouldn't you know it, I post I like Foster at #9 and 20 minutes later I read he failed a drug test......I wonder what drug it was?
    It was a diluted sample. He blames it on being sick and drinking too much water to stay hydrated... but in the NFL it doesn't matter it counts as a failed test.

  28. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by spicoli View Post
    My surprise pick is Charles Harris....kid is a flat out baller.
    NFL Rumors - April 20 Updates:
    Comment on these NFL Rumors

    The Jets really like Charles Harris, and he could be at the top Jets' big board. - James Parks, CBS
    If the Jets removed unrealistic candidates like Myles Garrett and Leonard Fournette, this is definitely plausible. There's been growing buzz that Harris will be chosen in the top 15, and New York could potentially obtain Harris if it moves down to No. 12, per the trade Charlie Campbell referenced in the NFL Draft Rumor Mill. -Walter
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  29. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by Lewdog View Post
    It was a diluted sample. He blames it on being sick and drinking too much water to stay hydrated... but in the NFL it doesn't matter it counts as a failed test.
    Only in the NFL can a person "fail" a drug test, even though there were no drugs.

    Some team will take the "chance" on this guy...and get a 10-year All Pro.
    "This game isn't worth it. The National Football League isn't worth it. There's golf to be played and tennis to be served up and other things to be done out there besides worryin' about a friggin' football game."----The prophet Sam Wyche

  30. #30
    Warren Sapp fell to the Buccaneers because there was a "report" that he smoked marijuana. He was a top three pick and wound up falling to #12.
    Only users lose drugs

  31. #31
    spicoli's Avatar
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    it's just not the "failed" drug test though with Foster, there were also some teams that wouldn't clear him medically either due to his shoulder injury......and then there was also the whole blowing up at the medical facility as well.....at this point, I'm gonna be pretty surprised if he gets into the top 20.

    as far as Ross, everything I've seen suggests that he passed all medicals and teams are comfortable with his shoulder.....I can't imagine him not coming in and competing for snaps on day one, if he's the guy at 9.
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  32. #32
    Sith Lord ralphmtsu's Avatar
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    Barnett/Reddick, I'd be happy with either. Howard is an interesting prospect. He's not an Eifert or Gronk, but he would give us an interesting 2 TE package. I just don't see us taking a TE that high. I don't see anyone taking Howard until mid-way in the first round. If we are going to talk strictly athlete with high football IQ and versatility, go bold and take Jabril Peppers. Risky but possible huge reward.
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  33. #33
    On Foster: his ceiling is the Ray Lewis, but his floor is that LB from George we drafted a while back who never panned out, I forget his name. Supposedly had a drug problem. Do you spend the 9th pick on that kind of gamble? I wouldn't. The only real question is whether we take him at 41 of he's still there.

    On Reddick: Yeah, he's great, but still a project who won't start until year 2 at the earliest. Guenther has flat out said they downgrade those projects as much as a round. Really don't see it happening. And we don't value LBs much.

    On Howard: I know a lot of folks here like him, and I get that he was underutilized at Alabama, but do you really want to spend a top ten pick on a guy at position that isn't a big need just because he put up monstrous measurables? I don't see it.

    There aren't a ton of options I'm really excited about to be honest.

  34. #34
    Administrator Super Cat's Avatar
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    Thurman?

  35. #35
    Quote Originally Posted by Bengali View Post
    I wouldn't use the word redshirted necessarily, but to answer Spicoli's question I meant because he's recovering from labrum surgery and would probably start on the PUP. And Wrs don't acclimate quickly in general. So his ceilling as a rookie to me is very good kick returner, and 4th WR and situational lid-lifter. That's still value to be sure, but it's year two that we'd have a lethal Green/Ross/Boyd combo.
    atm i dont have a problem with any position pick if they can suit up on day 1 and play, and at least be considered for a starting position ( not withstanding a TC or preseaon injury things do happen) this team right now does not have the luxury of projects and next year players. just curious if Ross is to be considered our KR and 4th Wr , what do you do with Ekerson the very solid returner and wr that played very well last year?

  36. #36
    Quote Originally Posted by Super Cat View Post
    Thurman?
    Yes, Odell Thurman... couldn't remember his name.

  37. #37
    Quote Originally Posted by Bengali View Post
    On Foster: his ceiling is the Ray Lewis, but his floor is that LB from George we drafted a while back who never panned out, I forget his name. Supposedly had a drug problem. Do you spend the 9th pick on that kind of gamble? I wouldn't. The only real question is whether we take him at 41 of he's still there.

    On Reddick: Yeah, he's great, but still a project who won't start until year 2 at the earliest. Guenther has flat out said they downgrade those projects as much as a round. Really don't see it happening. And we don't value LBs much.

    On Howard: I know a lot of folks here like him, and I get that he was underutilized at Alabama, but do you really want to spend a top ten pick on a guy at position that isn't a big need just because he put up monstrous measurables? I don't see it.

    There aren't a ton of options I'm really excited about to be honest.
    I'll agree up to Howard. Bengals have a penchant for drafting to fill holes for players a year removed from a contract and Eifert fits that bill. It's why the drafted Ogb and Fisch. Any by all accounts Howard is a hell of a talent. If he ends up being a Gronk or Graham he will be more than worth the pick. He is rated as a top blocking prospect to boot. He helps in the red zone, takes pressure off Green and Dalton's completion percentage goes up 10 fold with taller recievers (ha)

    Barnett makes a ton of sense but like everyone I worry that he is going to be a Keith Rivers type safe pick that never pans out.

    Reddick is not worth #9. Foster is out. Someone could fall so would they draft a safety? Who the hell knows.
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  38. #38
    That penchant for picking players a year removed from the end of their contract is exactly what drives me nuts. We draft to replace, not draft to build. Drafting OGB and Fisch is why we don't have Whitworth anymore. I agree we might take Howard, I just hope we don't.

  39. #39
    spicoli's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bengali View Post
    Drafting OGB and Fisch is why we don't have Whitworth anymore.
    huh? they offered Whit $11m this year and he took $13m from the Rams.

    I really don't think OGB and Fish had anything whatsoever to do with him leaving, they clearly wanted him back for at least one more season...they just didn't make the offer quite juicy enough to get it done.
    “We are not going in circles, we are going upwards. The path is a spiral; we have already climbed many steps.” --Hermann Hesse, Siddhartha

  40. #40
    Quote Originally Posted by spicoli View Post
    huh? they offered Whit $11m this year and he took $13m from the Rams.

    I really don't think OGB and Fish had anything whatsoever to do with him leaving, they clearly wanted him back for at least one more season...they just didn't make the offer quite juicy enough to get it done.
    I disagree. I think he was still sore over them picking his replacement two years ago. Remember the tweet that supposedly was from his wife about MB shoving it up his ass, or something like that? I still don't think that was his wife, and I think he signed a one year extension maybe because he felt bad, or he was worried. But then when he had a bunch of teams lining up to give him a big contract he said you know what, the Bengals didn't believe in me in 2015, i'll go somewhere where they think I'm the number one guy. The fact that it was only 2 mil more is my point: it wasn't the money, it was the principle.

    Besides, if we hadn't drafted Ogbuehi don't you think we'd have matched that 13 million? And he'd still be here. Plus whomever we might have picked instead of of Ogbuehi (though granted, I just went and checked and it would've been nobody super impressive. Maybe Bud Dupree or Shane Ray).

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